Maksim Shevchenko: ‘Donbass was returned with the support of Moscow under the rule of Ukrainian oligarchs’
Who could kill Motorola? Who rules in Kiev? Why is the West disrupting peace in Syria? How does the Russian-Turkish consortium relate to it?
On 20 October, the negotiations of the Normandy contact group took place in Berlin. Among the topics discussed, there were not only the conflict in the south-east of Ukraine and Minsk agreements implementation but also the situation in Syria. The murder of a famous militiaman Motorola in the entrance of the house just before this meeting adds piquancy. A famous journalist and expert on ethno-religious issues Maksim Shevchenko in an interview with the correspondent of Realnoe Vremya stated his position on these issues.
'Motorola was a bargaining chip'
The mass Arseny Pavlov (Motorola)'s wake has recently passed, which, according to some assessments, was attended by over 50 thousand people. Can we consider him a people's hero of Donbass?
Obviously, for those, who came to bury him, for those, who mourn his death — he is a hero. And for those, who did not come to bury him and do not mourn his death — he is not a hero. I think the approach should be rational. Motorola — a condottiero, a volunteer, who fought. First, he was a volunteer mercenary, then a platoon commander, a company commander. I wouldn't make some great figure of him. He is not a symbol of the Donetsk resistance. The symbols of the Donetsk resistance are Mozgovoy, Dremov, who, in my opinion, are more significant and major figures. But Russia preferred to keep quiet about them because their death is quite mysterious. But Motorola was mysteriously killed right before the 'Normandy negotiations'. Amazing coincidence, isn't it?
Some people have the assumption that he could be 'removed' by his own side. What do you think about that?
I don't know. It is a serious accusation. I can't say, but questions remain. How was it possible to carry out the attack in a secure house in a closed elevator? He is a military officer, a combat commander. What Ukranian group could set mine in his house when it is a super-protected object?
'I wouldn't make some great figure of him. He is not a symbol of the Donetsk resistance.' Photo: nv.ua
They say that people were round up to the funeral of Motorola. Do you believe in this assertion?
It doesn't matter whether I believe it or not. Do you have any proof of that?
Mr Shevchenko, the media wrote about this, especially the Ukrainian one.
I believe in anything. But Ukrainian journalists, in this case, are not authoritative sources. They are an interested party to the conflict.
Why the heroes of the Russian Spring in Donbass have been left out of the policy — killed, retired, exiled to Russia?
Motorola was not overboard. He was walking along Donetsk, hung with medals, participated in the parades. He just was not a key figure. He was a bargaining chip, in the end he was bargained.
Why social mobility in Donbass did work out in relation to the heroes of the Russian Spring, meanwhile, the activists of the Euromaidan are now in the Kiev government, sitting in Parliament?
Because no one wanted social change in Donbass. Donbass started as a real people's uprising and the entirely new people came to power. But then, Donbass was returned with the support of Moscow under the rule of Ukrainian oligarchs. And now Ukrainian oligarchs rule there through their puppets.
'In diplomacy, politicians often say one thing and do another. No one is obliged to say what they really think. In politics, only fools say what they really think.' Photo: kremlin.ru
What the Normandy format agreed about
During the meeting of Normandy format, it was decided that the military mission of the OSCE will enter the DNR and LNR. Is it necessary there or not?
The OSCE has no military mission. What the OSCE military mission? The OSCE has no status of armed observation.
I'm not a big specialist in this organization. Probably, something like the foreign police.
The OSCE has no authority to conduct an armed control, armed surveillance.
Why did Vladimir Putin after attempts of sabotage in Crimea state that he did not want to meet with Petro Poroshenko, however, the meeting was held?
Diplomats. And in diplomacy, politicians often say one thing and do another. No one is obliged to say what they really think. In politics, only fools say what they really think.
Some experts believe that the task of the Kremlin is to hand over the Russian-Ukrainian border so that externally it didn't look like ceding. The OSCE mission would be a good way. Do you agree with this point of view?
The Minsk agreements provide the transition of the Russian-Ukrainian border under the control of the Ukrainian border guards. So I don't know about what surrender you are talking about. It is simply the format of the Minsk agreements that you have to implement or not to.
'Russia and Turkey have common interests now — to end the Syrian war as soon as possible in order to ensure the security of gas transit, which will certainly be a powerful incentive for the Turkish economy and for Russian as well.' Photo: sdelanounas.ru
It's all about gas
The analysts say that the main issue discussed at the meeting in Berlin was not Donbass but the Syrian issue. Today the humanitarian pause in Aleppo ends. How will this temporary truce end?
I think that amid the unprecedented Turkish-Russian agreements, in particular in the gas contract, the formats of the Syria conflict are developing. Russia and Turkey have common interests now — to end the Syrian war as soon as possible in order to ensure the security of gas transit, which will certainly be a powerful incentive for the Turkish economy and for Russian one as well. Of course, Western Europe do not want to do that, as it will be dependent on the Turkish gas distributor — not very pleasant, frankly speaking, format for Western Europe. It is much more profitable when gas went through Ukraine, Ukraine was stealing gas, feeding themselves at the expense of this gas, and Western Europe was posing as a caring guardian of Ukrainian democracy. But now, Ukrainian 15 billion cubic meters will go through Turkey. Ukraine will be without gas, and Europe will have to have regard for the Russian-Turkish consortium. It will do everything to disrupt this consortium. One of the formats of breakdown of this consortium is the support and the outbreak of the Syrian war and the transfer of the Syrian war on the territory of the Turkish Republic.
I think that the Europeans, calling for peace in words, in fact, will support the Kurdish military forces, will support military forces in Syria and disrupt the peace formats and all peace talks. Because the peace means the Turkish-Russian gas consortium with the accession of Iran. And that means Europe's dependence on gas. The war is the continuation of the Great game, including on the gas utilities. Therefore, the European hypocrisy knows no bounds. Russia and Turkey have common interests now. Obviously, the Turks will turn a blind eye to Aleppo, and Russia and Iran would turn a blind eye to Mosul and the Kurdish territories.